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#1 kreso

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Posted 25 September 2016 - 08:13 AM

28. Remove junk from global scripts

11. Adjust FPS and fix audio skipping in cutscenes

 

Possibly best tweaks ever. :worship:  :worship:


Edited by kreso, 25 September 2016 - 08:13 AM.


#2 kreso

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Posted 01 February 2017 - 03:02 PM

28. Remove junk from global scripts

There's still whole lotta junk in these scripts. Is there really no better way after 20 years to deal with Habib's scimitar; cleric holy symbols, race checks for romances and similar? 



#3 DavidW

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Posted 01 February 2017 - 06:13 PM

In principle a few of them - the ones that only need to be checked once, or that are tied to a specific place or creature - could be moved to more specific scripts.

But I'm not sure I see the point. It won't make any meaningful difference to speed, and it will potentially break compatibility.

#4 Jarno Mikkola

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Posted 01 February 2017 - 10:16 PM

11. Adjust FPS and fix audio skipping in cutscenes

Actually, you create your own problem, by adjusting the DEFAULT FPS to anything else than the 30, you set the sounds off by just that. Should you know, the sound files are coded to contain the LENGTH of the sound, not just the pitch. You want the rest of use to just listen chipmunk sounds. And crash to desktop at Waukeen's Promenade.
No, thanks.

The FPS count in a game like this is a little different from a fighting game or first person shooter, as you can pause the game at any given time and take as long as you want to target. As in those games, a bad FPS count can determine if the game is enjoyable or not. Not in this.
Now, if you want to move faster... just use the faster running speed effect(opcode 126), as you should be able to cheat that in with your own mods, and if you are targeted by a fireball, have the balls to stand and take it.

Edited by Jarno Mikkola, 01 February 2017 - 10:30 PM.

Welcome to the sanity, you are free to search for the limit, it's out there, we drew it in the sand.
Here's how to install all the ... mods you ever really could want to Infinity Engine games. I removed the stable word from there as Roxanne began to add BS mods that are likely to break compatibility from the BWS.

#5 K4thos

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Posted 01 February 2017 - 10:41 PM

And crash to desktop at Waukeen's Promenade.

upload save that can be used to reproduce it on 60 FPS or it didn't happen. Never had issue like this and I've been playing on higher framerates since 1998 (always 45 or 60 though, so not sure about other values).
 

The FPS count in a game like this is a little different from a fighting game or first person shooter, as you can pause the game at any given time and take as long as you want to target. As in those games, a bad FPS count can determine if the game is enjoyable or not. Not in this.
Now, if you want to move faster... just use the faster running speed effect(opcode 126), as you should be able to cheat that in with your own mods, and if you are targeted by a fireball, have the balls to stand and take it.

with boots of speed I want to move 4x faster than you move without one on 30 FPS. And changing FPS adjusts everything in game (AI updates, round length etc.), so simply modifying movement and staying on 30 is not an option. For people that are used to higher speeds in IE engine games default 30 is literally unplayable (obviously the same is true the other way around - anything other than 30 will feel odd to you).


Edited by K4thos, 01 February 2017 - 11:00 PM.


#6 Jarno Mikkola

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Posted 01 February 2017 - 11:24 PM

 

And crash to desktop at Waukeen's Promenade.

upload save that can be used to reproduce it on 60 FPS or it didn't happen. Never had issue like this and I've been playing on higher framerates since 1998 (always 45 or 60 though, so not sure about other values).

You'll have to ask thief to do that...

 

 

with boots of speed I want to move 4x faster than you move without one on 30 FPS.

Well, you can actually do that. Just attach the opcode 126 effect to the kits for example, and then use the haste to haste. And should there be a need to add speed, well then just use the opcode 126 in the haste spell too.


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Here's how to install all the ... mods you ever really could want to Infinity Engine games. I removed the stable word from there as Roxanne began to add BS mods that are likely to break compatibility from the BWS.

#7 K4thos

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Posted 01 February 2017 - 11:39 PM

You'll have to ask thief to do that...

 

your claim, you ask :p Never had such problem for the last 20 years of playing these games. Based on the issue described in that topic it looks like the engine has problem with scaling the speed into 40 FPS, but it's not th case for 60 FPS at least.

 

Well, you can actually do that. Just attach the opcode 126 effect to the kits for example, and then use the haste to haste. And should there be a need to add speed, well then just use the opcode 126 in the haste spell too.

everything should be twice as fast for those used to 60 FPS in IE games, not just movement.


Edited by K4thos, 02 February 2017 - 12:16 AM.


#8 GrimLefourbe

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Posted 02 February 2017 - 01:36 AM

I don't think there's really any point arguing about that with him, don't waste valuable time. The tweak is awesome for those who use it and doesn't hurt anyone else. Not much more to say!



#9 kreso

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Posted 02 February 2017 - 06:47 AM

 

11. Adjust FPS and fix audio skipping in cutscenes

Actually, you create your own problem, by adjusting the DEFAULT FPS to anything else than the 30

I play on 50 FPS (60 is a bit too frentic for me, but I guess one can get used to it), never had issues. 

30 FPS is completely unplayable for me. 

 

In principle a few of them - the ones that only need to be checked once, or that are tied to a specific place or creature - could be moved to more specific scripts.

But I'm not sure I see the point. It won't make any meaningful difference to speed, and it will potentially break compatibility.

It does make a non-trivial change in speed/lag in magic-intense battles for me (altough, this may be due to my low-end laptop rather than script processing). I cut out 70% of baldur and baldur25 bcs files, and still go through the game w/o crashes.

Sure enough, my rep won't be lowered by 2 when I pick up Viconia, stronghold quests won't start, romances are disabled, I can summon familiar indefinitely and similar but after xth runthrough I really don't feel as if I'm missing anything..... 

It's just that I tought EEs would improve on this.



#10 Jarno Mikkola

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Posted 02 February 2017 - 08:43 AM

everything should be twice as fast for those used to 60 FPS in IE games, not just movement.

I willing to listen your arguments if you can say with a strait face that you have listened the aerie2501.wav -file with ~x2 the speed and said that it should sound like that. Use Near Infinity to export and Audiacity to listen for example. As that's what kreso asked.

I understand that playing a game on 30 FPS can be hard... but like said, the game was programmed to run at 30, so it should be played at that. You can view the youtube at x2 too, but I am pretty sure it's not really intended for the music videos. Yeah, it actually slightly skips instead of runs at x2 ... can you figure why... to avoid the chipmonkey effect you get by running sounds at x2 speed.


Edited by Jarno Mikkola, 02 February 2017 - 09:52 AM.

Welcome to the sanity, you are free to search for the limit, it's out there, we drew it in the sand.
Here's how to install all the ... mods you ever really could want to Infinity Engine games. I removed the stable word from there as Roxanne began to add BS mods that are likely to break compatibility from the BWS.

#11 DavidW

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Posted 02 February 2017 - 10:47 AM

It does make a non-trivial change in speed/lag in magic-intense battles for me (altough, this may be due to my low-end laptop rather than script processing). I cut out 70% of baldur and baldur25 bcs files, and still go through the game w/o crashes.
Sure enough, my rep won't be lowered by 2 when I pick up Viconia, stronghold quests won't start, romances are disabled, I can summon familiar indefinitely and similar but after xth runthrough I really don't feel as if I'm missing anything..... 
It's just that I tought EEs would improve on this.


I can believe that cutting 75% of baldur.bcs would give a speedup on low-end hardware. But probably only 5% can be cut safely.

I haven't tried it, but it's plausible that putting this block at the top would help:
 
IF
     GlobalTimerNotExpired("DMWWBaldur","GLOBAL")
THEN
     RESPONSE #100
NoAction()
END

IF    
     !GlobalTimerNotExpired("DMWWBaldur","GLOBAL")
THEN
     RESPONSE #100
        SetGlobalTimer("DMWWBaldur","GLOBAL",3)
        Continue()
END
That will mean that the script is checked only once per 3 seconds, rather than 30-60 times per second.

Edited by DavidW, 02 February 2017 - 10:49 AM.


#12 K4thos

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Posted 02 February 2017 - 11:20 AM

 

everything should be twice as fast for those used to 60 FPS in IE games, not just movement.

I willing to listen your arguments if you can say with a strait face that you have listened the aerie2501.wav -file with ~x2 the speed and said that it should sound like that. Use Near Infinity to export and Audiacity to listen for example. As that's what kreso asked.
 

not sure if I understand correctly but if you mean that sounds are speed up when you increase framerate in IE games than that's not the case. aerie2501.wav would sound exactly the same on 30 FPS and 60 FPS - try it out. It's game logic that increases in speed (round time, script updating, animation speed).

 

I understand that playing a game on 30 FPS can be hard... but like said, the game was programmed to run at 30, so it should be played at that. You can view the youtube at x2 too, but I am pretty sure it's not really intended for the music videos. Yeah, it actually slightly skips instead of runs at x2 ... can you figure why... to avoid the chipmonkey effect you get by running sounds at x2 speed.

the game comes with configuration tool which allows you to change the framerate. It's not some obscure hidden feature. It's been there since BG1 and is adjustable from options the same way as resolution etc. in all IE games other than PST (where you can only change it via INI file because PST doesn't really have configuration executable).

 

4ubSRfO.png


Edited by K4thos, 02 February 2017 - 11:31 AM.


#13 kreso

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Posted 02 February 2017 - 11:54 AM

I can believe that cutting 75% of baldur.bcs would give a speedup on low-end hardware. But probably only 5% can be cut safely.

On a non-Fixpacked, vanilla BG2 install which I used to no-reload speedrun BGT (failed vs Abazigal but whatever) I reduced approx 1500 code lines to less then 300. Ofc, what I do isn't applicable for a game studio that gives you romances/Lirarcor banters and similar, but still....Habib? Does the Jaheira romance viability (RACE - human, elf etc.) really need to be checked over and over again? Can't this be done at starting area once to set the global and leave it be? It's probably possible to set it via dialogue with her as well.

 

 

IF
     GlobalTimerNotExpired("DMWWBaldur","GLOBAL")
THEN
     RESPONSE #100
NoAction()
END

IF    
     !GlobalTimerNotExpired("DMWWBaldur","GLOBAL")
THEN
     RESPONSE #100
        SetGlobalTimer("DMWWBaldur","GLOBAL",3)
        Continue()
END
That will mean that the script is checked only once per 3 seconds, rather than 30-60 times per second.

 

Interesting. I'll definitely try it out.



#14 Jarno Mikkola

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Posted 02 February 2017 - 12:03 PM

not sure if I understand correctly but ...

You didn't re-read the thread above my post. And that's why you didn't understand that we are still responding to this original quote:

11. Adjust FPS and fix audio skipping in cutscenes

As you have to speed up the speech length timers as well to keep up to the cutscenes original consistency, so it won't skip around. But chipmonkey's it.
Welcome to the sanity, you are free to search for the limit, it's out there, we drew it in the sand.
Here's how to install all the ... mods you ever really could want to Infinity Engine games. I removed the stable word from there as Roxanne began to add BS mods that are likely to break compatibility from the BWS.

#15 GrimLefourbe

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Posted 02 February 2017 - 12:11 PM

That's not how the tweak work. What a waste of time.


Edited by GrimLefourbe, 02 February 2017 - 12:12 PM.




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