Does any mod fix the cheesy exploits?

[czacki]

Specially those:

 

1. Chaos shields stacking with themselves in spell sequencers

2. Ranger/Cleric being able to cast Druid spells of tiers 4-7

 

IIRC neither the g3 fixpack, nor Baldurdash does fix any of those?

 

if I recall correctly, both are engine issues?

[Jarno Mikkola]

I am not sure you understand what a cheesy exploit is... but.

2, can be tweaked out, with mods like the Divine Remix or Spell Revisions. THEY are not a FIX for it cause they will destroy other stuff besides ... the point being that the 7th level druid spells aren't that much better than the cleric spells. The actual cheese in the ranger cleric combo is that you can have a fighter and an all around good magic user unlike the cleric who has restrictive arsenal, as in there's no direct damage spells ... but you have to pay for it with the XP, loose of kits, etc. so ...

[czacki]

I am not sure you understand what a cheesy exploit is... but.

Do you?

 

Stacking chaos shields makes your reckless dweomer have 100% success rate, in other words, several more level 9-10 spells cast from LEVEL ONE spell which you can refuel through limited wish, by the way.

 

If that's not a cheesy exploit, what is one?

 

IIRC various mods fix the spelltrap-project image infinite spell exploit, but this one is left out.

 

It's not like I use those things, I'd just love to see things working as intended

[Jarno Mikkola]

Stacking chaos shields makes your reckless dweomer have 100% success rate, in other words, several more level 9-10 spells cast from LEVEL ONE spell which you can refuel through limited wish, by the way.

Or you could just take a cat nab and have the spells restored to you during the sleep, it's not like there's a time limit for how long the game can be played.

Ouh, and there's still the risk of bad things to happen when you take a Wild Mage. The +45(from the 3 spells) + level amount + random-wild level is, still a wild thing, as the table is not directly consistent 1=bad-25=kindabad-50=better-100=best one.

Yes, that or the Haste-Timestop-Harm-punch -insta-kill.

Or throw a lots of summons and later demons to a place and rest outside. 5xTrap-exit-reenter-5xTrap-exit... and so on insta-kill.

[czacki]

You can get +75 from chain contingency -> enemy sighted -> triple improved chaos shield at self. In BG2EE, there's also a +15 helm, so you don't even need chain contingency anymore, as 45+15+31 = 91, which translates to 95% success rate due to four effects in 95-100 range casting the spell mostly as intended. There is of course the random spell level fluctuation but more or less 90%+ success rate is pretty solid if you don't want chain contingency.

 

Sleeping is restricted in some places and in the midst of battling, obviously. The exploit is mostly aimed at infinite wishrest for your party through dweomer in the midst of battle, which completely breaks the difficulty of even SCS2 to nothing.

 

While this isn't really relevant (solo games "balance" doesn't really matter), it remains a bug, which brings me to a point: was it somehow fixed in any way by some mod?

 

I'm not here to argue. If you think knowing a level 1 spell and two level 7 spells should give you infinite spells and infinite wishrest during battles, feel free to think so. I consider it a major exploit. Just because there are other exploits doesn't mean this one isn't an exploit.

[Almateria]

You get infinite spells if you cast from a hotbar so lol anyway

[subtledoctor]

NRD itself is pure cheese. If I were to make a mod to fix wild mage exploits, the mod would simply remove NRD from the game. But no one would install that mod. My personal fix is to simply never play a wild mage.

 

As for ranger/clerics casting druid spells they're not meant to, IWDEE and BG2EE have fixed this. Presumably BGEE will with the next patch. If you're still play TOB or Tutu or BGT, you could try my Sxales of Balance mod. It doesn't fix the problem, but it addresses the problem: multiclass ranger/clerics are automatically given the Woodscout of Mielikki kit. These specialized priests of Mielikki are granted special dispensation by Slvanus to cast druid spells.

 

Rangers looking to dual-class to cleric *cannot* do so, unless they first abandon their original kit and become a Woodscout by using a special totem of Mielikki. Then they will get the druid spells, for the same reason.

 

In other words, I couldn't fix the exploit, so I just contextualized it within the game. Link in my sig if you're interested.

[critto]

 

 

As for ranger/clerics casting druid spells they're not meant to, IWDEE and BG2EE have fixed this. Presumably BGEE will with the next patch. If you're still play TOB or Tutu or BGT, you could try my Sxales of Balance mod.

 

Apologies for digging up a somewhat old thread, didn't see any reason to create a new one. I've been investigating the issue with R->C dual-classes being able to cast druidic spells. I am right to understand that this is considered a bug of the vanilla, non-EE game? If so, is it hardcoded? It's been around for ages and I can't remember seeing someone address it which leads me to suspect that this is something inside the game engine.

[subtledoctor]

Yeah it's hard coded. I speculate that it was easy to open up druid spells to R/Cs, because druid spells are marked as available to anyone with the ranger/druid class flags; but it was hard to limit them to a certain level, because a whole new mechanism to do so would have to be coded into the game. And anyway while it contradicts the rules, it does so in a way that benefits the player and Bioware seems to have erred on the side of letting bugs through when they benefit the player.

 

There's not much you can do about it in the vanilla engine, without an .exe hack... and there isn't anyone around who's capable of doing those anymore.

 

My mod *explains* the bug, since I can't fix it: it disallows any dual-classing from ranger to cleric, unless you switch into a ranger kit called a Woodscout that honors Mielikki, goddess of rangers; the special benefit of that kit is that Mielikki grants you access to the high-level druid spells (presumably from some deal she worked out with Silvanus or Chauntea). Multiclass R/Cs are automatically shunted into the Woodscout kit after character creation.

 

(The Woodscout is an actual 2E kit for a priest of Mielikki, which combines the abilities of rangers and clerics; I just assorted it to fit the bugged BG game rules.)

[critto]

I see, thanks. This might sound kind of strange, but what I am looking to reproduce is the vanilla behaviour in EE. Is it possible? If I just remove exclusion flags, the druid spells would pop up in priests' books by default, right?

[subtledoctor]

Well, I think BGEE (1.3) already acts like vanilla TOB. And BG2EE (1.3.2064) and IWDEE (1.4) have a setting in the Baldur.ini file that will restore high-level druid spells if you switch it. (It's under Program Options, called "ranger_cleric_spells" or something similarly obvious.)

 

So, no hacking/modding needed.

[critto]

Huh. Thanks, I'll check it out.

[InKal]

yeah

 

 

ranger/cleric's druidic spells are disabled by default in BG2EE and IWEE (both games are on the same engine).

 

 

'Game Options', 'Cleric Ranger Spells', '1' disabled

'Game Options', 'Cleric Ranger Spells', '0' enabled

 

http://forums.beamdog.com/discussion/37833/a-bunch-of-neat-baldur-ini-options-in-bg2ee-1-3-that-ive-noticed-carry-overs-from-iwdee

[subtledoctor]

Probably goes without saying but just to clarify: only the high-level druid spells (i.e. the spells that single-class rangers and clerics don't get access to) are disabled by default. Ranger/clerics do get druid spells of levels 1-3, as they are supposed to.

[Ardanis]

In BG2EE, there's also a +15 helm, so you don't even need chain contingency anymore, as 45+15+31 = 91

Except I fixed the stacking issue in BG2EE, exactly because of the additional items