Jarno Mikkola Posted January 23, 2015 Share Posted January 23, 2015 What about this: give the creature 1/2 the casters hp, regardless of class, but have it otherwise level up per their wizard levels? That way your wizard/thief 1/20 doesn't have a familiar walking through throne of bhaal with 2hp(?) Ouh, yeah, and give it the rogue skills of it's host, and Thac0 of based on it's fighter level, even if it's no one. And Save throws based on the games chapter account and AC according to how many party members the player has in he current group... hmm ouh NO ! All those ideas are NOT good ones. Let's just let Salk make his own mind and mod and then judge after, K? Again my opinion is that the Caster level should rule all the things, but that's just my opinion... Salk can have any of these ideas, but I recommend none of them. Quote Link to comment
Salk Posted January 23, 2015 Author Share Posted January 23, 2015 (edited) What about this: give the creature 1/2 the casters hp, regardless of class, but have it otherwise level up per their wizard levels? That way your wizard/thief 1/20 doesn't have a familiar walking through throne of bhaal with 2hp(?) Edit I like that idea: I always worry that the little guys will die... I understand the worry and I feel the same. My objection to a similar change is, again, conceptual: why would the Familiar gain those HPs without levelling up? The extra HP bonus has always been tied to an improvement in level. Also, it would open to an exploit: having a single Mage level just to gain the extra HPs (by the way, now it won't just be as convenient to summon a familiar just to park them in the backpack: they will nag about it! ) - I worked hard to try and make the familiar have a more active role in the game. Edited January 23, 2015 by Salk Quote Link to comment
Salk Posted January 23, 2015 Author Share Posted January 23, 2015 Let's just let Salk make his own mind and mod and then judge after, K? Thanks for the vote of confidence but Grammarsalad did just what I asked: give me his opinion, which I am grateful for. Quote Link to comment
Grammarsalad Posted January 23, 2015 Share Posted January 23, 2015 (edited) What about this: give the creature 1/2 the casters hp, regardless of class, but have it otherwise level up per their wizard levels? That way your wizard/thief 1/20 doesn't have a familiar walking through throne of bhaal with 2hp(?) Edit I like that idea: I always worry that the little guys will die... I understand the worry and I feel the same. My objection to a similar change is, again, conceptual: why would the Familiar gain those HPs without levelling up? The extra HP bonus has always been tied to an improvement in level. Also, it would open to an exploit: having a single Mage level just to gain the extra HPs (by the way, now it won't just be as convenient to summon a familiar just to park them in the backpack: they will nag about it! ) - I worked hard to try and make the familiar have a more active role in the game. That is a good question. Okay, maybe something like this: Familiars are unique creatures that have their own unique rules. They don't gain experience as a normal creature; their growth is intimately tied to their "master". While their "skill" is informed by the masters magical skill, their "life force" is, in some sense, tied to the masters life force; this is why the caster suffers physically when the familiar dies. As a character (ie the caster) levels up, their "life force" gets stronger (well, hit points represent a lot of things, but this as much as anything, no?) It seems that, if they are so closely tied in this way, then as the casters "life force"gets stronger, so does the familiars. Something like that Edits all over the place, but also this: this is the justification; in the background is the concern for the little guy's squishyness Edited January 23, 2015 by Grammarsalad Quote Link to comment
Salk Posted January 23, 2015 Author Share Posted January 23, 2015 (edited) Well, the question presented like this has its merit, Grammarsalad but I still see two problems: 1) the level up of the familiar grants improvements that helps its survival beyond the mere number of Hit Points: I am speaking of Armor Class and Saving Throws improvement, THAC0, weapon enchantment, skills and special abilities. And (2) the way I see it, it's more the Master's life force being boosted by the Familiar and not viceversa. Your theory seems to imply the familiar's total HPs depends on the the Master's life force instead. In my mod, the Master loses the extra HPs gained through the familiar but does *not* get any additional HP damage. The consequences of the death of the Familiar changed from the original spell. As said, the extra HPs are gone, the constitution penalty is temporary (3 days, I might consider going down to 2 - mourning period) in order to avoid reloads, during the mourning no familiar can be summoned. At the death of the familiar the Master will roll for a System Shock (Constitution modified) save or fall unconscious for a short period due to the violently severed bond. Edited January 23, 2015 by Salk Quote Link to comment
Salk Posted January 23, 2015 Author Share Posted January 23, 2015 Beta 2 has been uploaded. - Tentative change towards an exclusive Mage class only level up system - Changed some variables from global to locals - Squashed a couple of bugs Quote Link to comment
Grammarsalad Posted January 23, 2015 Share Posted January 23, 2015 Well, the question presented like this has its merit, Grammarsalad but I still see two problems: 1) the level up of the familiar grants improvements that helps its survival beyond the mere number of Hit Points: I am speaking of Armor Class and Saving Throws improvement, THAC0, weapon enchantment, skills and special abilities. And (2) the way I see it, it's more the Master's life force being boosted by the Familiar and not viceversa. Your theory seems to imply the familiar's total HPs depends on the the Master's life force instead. In my mod, the Master loses the extra HPs gained through the familiar but does *not* get any additional HP damage. The consequences of the death of the Familiar changed from the original spell. As said, the extra HPs are gone, the constitution penalty is temporary (3 days, I might consider going down to 2 - mourning period) in order to avoid reloads, during the mourning no familiar can be summoned. At the death of the familiar the Master will roll for a System Shock (Constitution modified) save or fall unconscious for a short period due to the violently severed bond. 1) Well, yeah, but there should be some limits. I had the imps objections in my head before he voiced them 2) I suppose...but in the op, it says that the familiar gets half the casters hp. The fact that hp are so tied seems to suggest a two way connection Quote Link to comment
Salk Posted January 23, 2015 Author Share Posted January 23, 2015 (edited) 1) Well, yeah, but there should be some limits. I had the imps objections in my head before he voiced them 2) I suppose...but in the op, it says that the familiar gets half the casters hp. The fact that hp are so tied seems to suggest a two way connection The Familiars' level up and skill development is associated to either the Thief, the Fighter class or the Mage class (with an exception for the Faerie Dragon which benefits of the Druid/Mage table for saving throws) because the creatures' natural abilities and tendencies are closest to one of those classes. The only common ground I had for them is the Hit Points that is the same for all. Practically each aspect of this modification has solid PnP roots with very few exceptions (the spider's poison resistance, some resistances improving with level instead of being absolute from the very beginning or the alignment of the Rabbit - it's all that comes to mind) so that the level up system is not really arbitrary but carefully planned out. I will just have to get some feedback from players and see if there can be improvements to be made. Edited January 23, 2015 by Salk Quote Link to comment
Shaitan Posted February 4, 2015 Share Posted February 4, 2015 Hi Salk Why isn't it usable with EasyTutu? Cheers Quote Link to comment
Salk Posted February 5, 2015 Author Share Posted February 5, 2015 (edited) Hi Shaitan. Because I didn't provide for additional code for EasyTuTu compatibility. With my very limited modding knowledge, I had to dedicate all the efforts into making it 100% BGT compatible. If anyone wants to help to make it compatible with EasyTuTu, I'd like the help. Otherwise I will eventually probably learn how to do it myself (maybe)... Edited February 5, 2015 by Salk Quote Link to comment
Shaitan Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 Ok, thay sound very understandable Quote Link to comment
Jarno Mikkola Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 (edited) Because I didn't provide for additional code for EasyTuTu compatibility. With my very limited modding knowledge, I had to dedicate all the efforts into making it 100% BGT compatible. If anyone wants to help to make it compatible with EasyTuTu, I'd like the help. Just tell us what exact knowledge do you need ? Erhm, it's likely the same knowledge you needed from the BG2 to BGT cross over ... Or testers, code assistance... Ouh, and have to ask, was Rabain ever knows as "Chevar", cause that's his prefix(WT*) that nearly all the mod files have and it's extremely bad for compatibility if it's not the case. Edited February 5, 2015 by Jarno Mikkola Quote Link to comment
Salk Posted February 5, 2015 Author Share Posted February 5, 2015 (edited) Just tell us what exact knowledge do you need ? Erhm, it's likely the same knowledge you needed from the BG2 to BGT cross over ... Or testers, code assistance... Ouh, and have to ask, was Rabain ever knows as "Chevar", cause that's his prefix(WT*) that nearly all the mod files have and it's extremely bad for compatibility if it's not the case. I'll get around to make it EasyTuTu compatible... I'll probably just need to convert some areas and change a few things in the .d files... Shouldn't be too hard... And no, WT is not Rabain's prefix (it's BK)... Edited February 5, 2015 by Salk Quote Link to comment
Mad Mate Posted March 22, 2015 Share Posted March 22, 2015 (edited) Great mod, Salk!Just found some bug that leads to CTD.It happens only in TOB. It is easy to reproduce. Start TOB, Cast FF, then choose familiar (any one), CTD with: ASSERTION FAILED! Return Address: 0x8BA209 File: ObjCreature.cpp Line: 12162 Expression: pCreature != NULL && creatureSize > 0 Message: (null) In BG1 part of BGT spell works fine and in BG2 I couldn't test it (spell fails indoors).Using clean BGT (weidu.log): // Log of Currently Installed WeiDU Mods// The top of the file is the 'oldest' mod// ~TP2_File~ #language_number #component_number // [subcomponent Name -> ] Component Name [ : Version]~TOBEX/TOBEX.TP2~ #0 #100 // TobEx - Core: Beta 0026~TOBEX/TOBEX.TP2~ #0 #101 // Apply Concentration Check On Damage [WIP]: Beta 0026~TOBEX/TOBEX.TP2~ #0 #102 // Awaken On Damage: Beta 0026~TOBEX/TOBEX.TP2~ #0 #105 // No Spell Interruption On Zero Damage: Beta 0026~TOBEX/TOBEX.TP2~ #0 #107 // Allow All Races to Dual Class: Beta 0026~TOBEX/TOBEX.TP2~ #0 #108 // Allow Equipping Armor in Combat: Beta 0026~TOBEX/TOBEX.TP2~ #0 #109 // Disable Experience Boost: Beta 0026~TOBEX/TOBEX.TP2~ #0 #111 // Disable Silence On Charm: Beta 0026~TOBEX/TOBEX.TP2~ #0 #112 // Level One Proficiency Restrictions: Beta 0026~TOBEX/TOBEX.TP2~ #0 #113 // Remain Hidden On Pickpocket Success [C]: Beta 0026~TOBEX/TOBEX.TP2~ #0 #114 // Rest Spawns Advance Time: Beta 0026~TOBEX/TOBEX.TP2~ #0 #115 // Dialogue Greeting Subtitles: Beta 0026~TOBEX/TOBEX.TP2~ #0 #116 // Enable Animation Attack Sounds: Beta 0026~TOBEX/TOBEX.TP2~ #0 #117 // Universal Four Inventory Weapon Slots: Beta 0026~TOBEX/TOBEX.TP2~ #0 #118 // Subtitles For Standard Soundsets: Beta 0026~TOBEX/TOBEX.TP2~ #0 #120 // Drop Inventory on Disintegrate: Beta 0026~TOBEX/TOBEX.TP2~ #0 #121 // Drop Inventory on Frozen Death: Beta 0026~TOBEX/TOBEX.TP2~ #0 #122 // Drop Inventory on Stone Death: Beta 0026~TOBEX/TOBEX.TP2~ #0 #123 // Enable Auto-Pause On All Screens: Beta 0026~TOBEX/TOBEX.TP2~ #0 #124 // Make All Attack Animations Genuine Attacks: Beta 0026~BG2FIXPACK/SETUP-BG2FIXPACK.TP2~ #0 #0 // BG2 Fixpack - Core Fixes: v11 Alpha 1~BG2FIXPACK/SETUP-BG2FIXPACK.TP2~ #0 #1000 // BG2 Fixpack - Game Text Update -> GTU Light (by Wisp): v11 Alpha 1~BG2FIXPACK/SETUP-BG2FIXPACK.TP2~ #0 #3 // BETA Core Fixes (please check the readme!): v11 Alpha 1~BG2FIXPACK/SETUP-BG2FIXPACK.TP2~ #0 #100 // Party Gets XP for Sending Keldorn to Reconcile With Maria: v11 Alpha 1~BG2FIXPACK/SETUP-BG2FIXPACK.TP2~ #0 #101 // Improved Spell Animations: v11 Alpha 1~BG2FIXPACK/SETUP-BG2FIXPACK.TP2~ #0 #102 // Cromwell's Forging Actually Takes a Day: v11 Alpha 1~BG2FIXPACK/SETUP-BG2FIXPACK.TP2~ #0 #103 // Mixed-Use Dagger Fixes: v11 Alpha 1~BG2FIXPACK/SETUP-BG2FIXPACK.TP2~ #0 #104 // Ghreyfain's Holy Symbol Fixes: v11 Alpha 1~BG2FIXPACK/SETUP-BG2FIXPACK.TP2~ #0 #106 // Giants Receive Penalties When Attacking Halflings, Dwarves, and Gnomes: v11 Alpha 1~BG2FIXPACK/SETUP-BG2FIXPACK.TP2~ #0 #107 // Remove Dual-Classing Restriction from Archers and Stalkers: v11 Alpha 1~BG2FIXPACK/SETUP-BG2FIXPACK.TP2~ #0 #108 // Remove Second Attribute Bonus for Evil Path in Wrath Hell Trial: v11 Alpha 1~BG2FIXPACK/SETUP-BG2FIXPACK.TP2~ #0 #109 // Corrected Summoned Demon Behavior: v11 Alpha 1~BG2FIXPACK/SETUP-BG2FIXPACK.TP2~ #0 #110 // Additional Script Fixes: v11 Alpha 1~BG2FIXPACK/SETUP-BG2FIXPACK.TP2~ #0 #111 // Bard Song Fixes: v11 Alpha 1~BG2FIXPACK/SETUP-BG2FIXPACK.TP2~ #0 #112 // Wizard Slayers Cause Miscast Magic on Ranged Attacks: v11 Alpha 1~BG2FIXPACK/SETUP-BG2FIXPACK.TP2~ #0 #113 // Additional Alignment Fixes: v11 Alpha 1~BG2FIXPACK/SETUP-BG2FIXPACK.TP2~ #0 #114 // Change Free Action to Protect Against Stun: v11 Alpha 1~BG2FIXPACK/SETUP-BG2FIXPACK.TP2~ #0 #115 // Paws from Shapeshifting Can Not Be Dispelled: v11 Alpha 1~BG2FIXPACK/SETUP-BG2FIXPACK.TP2~ #0 #116 // Remove Thieving Start Bonuses from Bard and Ranger Skills: v11 Alpha 1~SETUP-BGT.TP2~ #0 #0 // Baldur's Gate Trilogy - Core: 1.18 (28 Apr 13) BWP Fix~SETUP-BGTMUSIC.TP2~ #0 #2 // Baldur's Gate Trilogy - Music -> Full Baldur's Gate/Shadows of Amn/Throne of Bhaal Music (WARNING: patches BGMain.exe)~WTPFAMILIAR/SETUP-WTPFAMILIAR.TP2~ #0 #0 // WTPFamiliars (Requires Throne of Bhaal) 1.0 Beta 2: 1.0 Beta 2 Edited March 22, 2015 by Mad Mate Quote Link to comment
Salk Posted March 23, 2015 Author Share Posted March 23, 2015 Oh thanks for reporting it... I had tried the spell at the beginning of ToB (BGT) and it didn't crash... I'll try and see if I can find the problem. Quote Link to comment
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You are posting as a guest. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.