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Scales of Balance: post-hac tweaks and kit pack


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#31 subtledoctor

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Posted 15 May 2015 - 06:24 AM

Ah. Yeah see I hate that kind of thing. If you know, does SCS check immunities and apy a d riot based on what it finds? Or does it just have a list of creatures and apply scripts based in their vanilla stats?

If the former, then it shouldn't be a problem to change creatures up...

Faiths & Powers: Spell spheres and kit pack for priests and paladins
Might & Guile: Tweaks and kits for warriors and rogues
Scales of Balance: Game tweaks and rule overhauls
NPC_EE: More options for NPCs in BGEE, SoD, & BG2EE


#32 kreso

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Posted 15 May 2015 - 08:21 AM

Ah. Yeah see I hate that kind of thing. If you know, does SCS check immunities and apy a d riot based on what it finds? Or does it just have a list of creatures and apply scripts based in their vanilla stats?

If the former, then it shouldn't be a problem to change creatures up...

It checks for creature race when building scripts. Rakshasa/Lich types don't need to cast Globes of Invlnerability/Mantles and similar stuff since they're immune to spells below level x and can't be harmed by non-magical weapons. 

Likewise, this feat allows them to throw Fireballs/Skull Trap and similar at you without harming themselves, which isn't something SCS mages do (unless it's fairly safe to do so).



#33 ithildurnew

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Posted 17 May 2015 - 12:55 PM

Interesting mod; I've installed the multiclass tweaks component and am trying out the Bladesinger kit. One thing I've noticed is that the Bladesinger gains spells castable per day as if he'd gained a wizard level, when he gains levels in wizard AND Bladesinger BOTH. Is this by design? It means he ends up progressing in spellcasting ability waaay faster than a standard Fighter/Mage, which is debatably one of the most devastating class choices in BG2 to begin with...

 

I realize the 2e Bladesinger kit was considered extremely powerful (which fits the descriptive fluff/lore more or less, along with having some stringent restrictions), but I would say this along with the other advantages this particular version of the kit gets makes him extremely unbalanced.


Edited by ithildurnew, 17 May 2015 - 01:02 PM.


#34 subtledoctor

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Posted 17 May 2015 - 01:42 PM

I noticed that in my recent IWDEE game with a Bladesinger and a Spellfilcher: They both gained an extra 1st level spell when jumping from 1st to 2nd level in their non-wizard class (which is not supposed to happen) and then another spell when leveling up as a wizard (which is).

It's as if the game is treating it like a specialist, with a delayed reaction. Is it restricting you from Necromancy spells? Maybe using the Illusionist usability flag on a fighter kit is causing it. In which case the way faster advancement you're seeing is probably just that extra one spell per level.

I'll remove it in v3, which should be released next week (probably).

Faiths & Powers: Spell spheres and kit pack for priests and paladins
Might & Guile: Tweaks and kits for warriors and rogues
Scales of Balance: Game tweaks and rule overhauls
NPC_EE: More options for NPCs in BGEE, SoD, & BG2EE


#35 ithildurnew

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Posted 17 May 2015 - 04:51 PM

So it's not intended by design, gotcha. Is there a way to fix this via NI or SK (so as to not add the extra slot at lvl up; I'm currently manually removing the slot every time this occurs via NI/SK)? I'm not aware of where the specialist usability flag data is stored.

 

As for necromancy spells being restricted, I haven't had a chance to come across one yet, will report if such is the case.

 

Also, a suggestion/request, if you could restrict Bladesingers from using armor heavier than chain mail, I think it would help with both balance as well as match the 2e incarnation more closely.


Edited by ithildurnew, 17 May 2015 - 04:57 PM.


#36 subtledoctor

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Posted 17 May 2015 - 06:45 PM

Actually I checked, and the Bladesinger is coded for Trueclass usability. So it's not a specialist thing. I'm switching it from s fighter kit to a wizard kit, I'll test how it works that way. It's possible that it's a hard-coded thing, that any kitted wizard automatically gets the specialist bonus.

Also, if you're using my altered spell tables, all wizards get slightly more lower-level spells than in vanilla. So you might be seeing that, and not a Bladesinger issue at all. Or it could be a combination of the two. I'll look into it.

I didn't even consider armor - never thought someone would put heavy armor on a fighter/mage. But I can restrict that. I'll check into what class restrictions to give them. Barbarian might be could, they max at splint, right? Or thief - studded leather plus Elven chain?

Faiths & Powers: Spell spheres and kit pack for priests and paladins
Might & Guile: Tweaks and kits for warriors and rogues
Scales of Balance: Game tweaks and rule overhauls
NPC_EE: More options for NPCs in BGEE, SoD, & BG2EE


#37 ithildurnew

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Posted 17 May 2015 - 11:00 PM

Keep in mind standard fighter/mages can put on full plate or banded/splint mail etc when they run out of spells and function pretty much just like fighters. Bladesingers should have the same armor restrictions as thieves or perhaps bards/Blade kit, though otherwise item useage should be the same as other fighter/mages.

 

 

I'm not using any other components other than the multiclass component, so no altered spell tables (other than the ones provided by BG2Tweaks, but those only effect the wizard levels side of things). It's also not an illusionist specialist thing because I can use necromancy spells/scrolls without any issues. I'm guessing if you switched fighter kit to a wizard kit that may be the issue.

 

 

 

One other thing: http://www.shsforums...rs/#entry577681

 

I've confirmed that ever since obtaining the kit, whenever I try to rest with injured members in the party, the game crashes to desktop with the errors listed above. It seems some part of the bladesinger component isn't interacting well with the Rest/heal x amount of hp's routine that's supposed to run when resting (the crash so far only occurs if someone in the party is injured).

 

[edit] Further confirmed that it's D5_BLAD1.spl that's the issue; removing it via SK from the character allowed resting with injured members in the party without ctd. In fact, using the spell at all results in a ctd regardless of resting or not.


Edited by ithildurnew, 18 May 2015 - 01:04 AM.


#38 subtledoctor

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Posted 18 May 2015 - 03:35 AM

What, really?? Is that the Bladesinging ability? I just played a whole game of IWDEE on my iPad, never had a problem. That ability is based Blades' Offensive Spin, it's not even a fully home brewed thing.

Sigh. I'll look into it.

Faiths & Powers: Spell spheres and kit pack for priests and paladins
Might & Guile: Tweaks and kits for warriors and rogues
Scales of Balance: Game tweaks and rule overhauls
NPC_EE: More options for NPCs in BGEE, SoD, & BG2EE


#39 ithildurnew

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Posted 18 May 2015 - 02:15 PM

Yeah I figured it might be based on Offensive Spin, so I replaced the default D5_Blad1.spl with a copy of Offensive Spin with added ac bonus (btw, when I set the ac bonus to be vs melee, i.e. checked the boxes for slashing, crushing, piercing, it crashed. when I unchecked them, i.e. applicable vs all attacks, crashing stopped) and thac0 bonus scaled to be +1 every 5 lvls, and it seems to work fine now.

 

Also toned the ac bonus down slightly, +1 at lvl 1, +2 at lvl 5, +4 at 10, +6 at 15 (matches 2e Bladesinger more closely; overall he's still more powerful than pnp 2e, but at least he's a guy locked into single weapon style which balances out vs how powerful BG2 makes dual wielders). I might also remove the 'immunity to haste' effect as there's no such restriction for bladesingers and their capstone ability in 3e is the ability to gain 2 additional attacks/rnd via Song of Fury plus Haste. It still falls short of what dual wielders can do, but imo brings them closer to an iconic flurry of single weapon slashing fury.

 

As for the extra spell slots, for now I'll just remove them via SK or NI manually.


Edited by ithildurnew, 18 May 2015 - 02:24 PM.


#40 subtledoctor

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Posted 18 May 2015 - 04:04 PM

Yeah I figured it might be based on Offensive Spin, so I replaced the default D5_Blad1.spl with a copy of Offensive Spin with added ac bonus (btw, when I set the ac bonus to be vs melee, i.e. checked the boxes for slashing, crushing, piercing, it crashed. when I unchecked them, i.e. applicable vs all attacks, crashing stopped) and thac0 bonus scaled to be +1 every 5 lvls, and it seems to work fine now.


That spell is all sorts of problematic. It also wipes out my quickslot spells whenever I cast it. Why? Who knows.

Also I think I started with Ofennsive Spin from an EE game, so there's probably some cruft in the file that causes problems in the old engine. I'll probably just build a whole new ability from the ground up instead of using Offensive Spin.

Faiths & Powers: Spell spheres and kit pack for priests and paladins
Might & Guile: Tweaks and kits for warriors and rogues
Scales of Balance: Game tweaks and rule overhauls
NPC_EE: More options for NPCs in BGEE, SoD, & BG2EE


#41 kreso

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Posted 18 May 2015 - 05:07 PM

when I set the ac bonus to be vs melee, i.e. checked the boxes for slashing, crushing, piercing, it crashed.

You can do that, but you must add seperate AC bonus headers (one for slash, one for crush etc.). Ticking 2 or more boxes is crash.



#42 Bill Bisco

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Posted 18 May 2015 - 06:21 PM

subtle,

 

I really like your idea, but I'm having trouble with your mod.  I don't like the multiclass changes and I don't want to include it, but I do like your options to set NPCs as certain kits.  The options in BWS let me not install the Multiclass changes, but let me install things like Aerie as a Fastpaws.

 

Is there a way you could recode this to disconnect the two?  As of now, I can't use the mod at all as the install errors prevented me from installing the NPC kits.

 

Thanks,

 

BIll



#43 subtledoctor

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Posted 18 May 2015 - 07:05 PM

I don't think Aerie's component requires the multiclass tweaks. I have heard that some people on BWS are getting errors with the NPC components. That happens when there are more than 255 kits installed - congratulations, you must have a rather aggressive BWS install.

If you can wait a week or two, v3.0 will address this issue, allowing the kitted NPC components to install with as many as 1280 kits installed.

Faiths & Powers: Spell spheres and kit pack for priests and paladins
Might & Guile: Tweaks and kits for warriors and rogues
Scales of Balance: Game tweaks and rule overhauls
NPC_EE: More options for NPCs in BGEE, SoD, & BG2EE


#44 ithildurnew

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Posted 18 May 2015 - 11:11 PM

 

when I set the ac bonus to be vs melee, i.e. checked the boxes for slashing, crushing, piercing, it crashed.

You can do that, but you must add seperate AC bonus headers (one for slash, one for crush etc.). Ticking 2 or more boxes is crash.

 

 

 

This may be the culprit for the ctd then; it was that way in the default D5_Blad1.spl file, 3 boxes checked in one ac bonus header.

 

 

 

 

 

Also, the Bladesinger kit cannot progress past specialization in any weapons, in spite of what the readme says. Kitlist.2da looks fine and weaponprof.2da has up to 5 pips in several weapons for Bladesinger, however upon testing it seems it's using the standard fighter/mage's column (tweaking the standard ftr/mage column allowed me to advance past specialization). If it matters, the name on top of the character record as well as the kit description from the same page also show 'Fighter/Mage', not Bladesinger. The only place where 'Bladesinger' shows is the right side 'parchment' area by the experience points.

 

I'm not using EE, btw, but a fairly standard BGT/ToB installation.


Edited by ithildurnew, 19 May 2015 - 02:43 AM.


#45 kreso

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Posted 19 May 2015 - 03:03 AM

 

 

when I set the ac bonus to be vs melee, i.e. checked the boxes for slashing, crushing, piercing, it crashed.

You can do that, but you must add seperate AC bonus headers (one for slash, one for crush etc.). Ticking 2 or more boxes is crash.

 

 

 

This may be the culprit for the ctd then; it was that way in the default D5_Blad1.spl file, 3 boxes checked in one ac bonus header.

 

If that was the case, using this ability is sure CTD. Maybe IWDEE engine (or other EEs) support it, but vanilla game surely doesn't.





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