Does anyone know the current status of the BWS?

[Roxanne]

Come on, the mod info for BWS and its fixpack is all on github and there's nothing really arcane about it. The community could easily pick up the slack. In fact, it would be even better if modders notified the fixpack people themselves or even submitted the patches (file deletions) necessary.

 

Mods that are hosted on github have largely been updated in bws to track the latest release automatically, so in that case only the fixpack needs tweaking as changes get incorporated back upstream, if any.

In theory - but sadly it is the same people maintaining both...

Although it is on github and e.g. myself I have made contributions for fixpack, I have not put them into the fixpack directly. Like many other modders, we can do the weidu and game code but when it comes to other code/scripts, we are lost.

[lynx]

I can't test bws, but if all you need is more instructions and tutorials on how to contribute, I can easily help with that.

 

You have to keep in mind the separation of bws the package manager/frontend (static, I guess, and can be mostly left alone) and the data, which is mostly plain text, much more readable than weidu.

[jastey]

Tutorials would be awesome. I could imagine contributing for my own mods, but I really have no idea where to start.

[Creepin]

Tutorials would be awesome.

Seconding this. Once more people will understand how to update mods for newer versions, add new mods, set up dependancies and so on, the ball will roll. I tried to figure it out by myself once, and Bhaal knows even with dabus' help it was harder than squeezing lvl9 spell into my brain.

[subtledoctor]

Not for nothing I repeatedly advocated that BWS *not* encourage people to be dependent on it. It's a great tool but letting it become so central to mod installation was a mistake. Having it so closely tied to the BWFixPack was also a mistake. Keeping things distinct and modular ensures that people can keep going even if one link in the chain breaks.

 

BUT:

 

- The existing (legacy) version of BWS is in good shape and pulls the most up-to-date versions of a lot of mods automatically... I could update my mods and BWS users will get the benefit of that, even if the BWS itself is not updated. So it's not useless just because AL|EN is leaving it;

 

- Agb1 and AL|EN and others did a lot of good work turning the BWFixPack into an independent, cross-platform entity. It's on Github for anyone to improve it, and it's in good shape right now;

 

- EET is already in good shape, and k4thos is generally still working on it as far as we know;

 

- Wisp is working on a cross-platform GUI version of Weidu, which could perhaps take the place of the BWS. It doesn't auto-sort your install order, but install order is really not that difficult (QNISKTS - Quests, NPCs, Items, Spells, Kits, Tweaks, SCS). And maybe some enterprising individuals can bolt a load-order utility onto GUI Weidu using the info in the BWS source code.

 

- A new version of SCS is on the way!

 

The mod scene will be fine. Mod users will have to buck up and deal with Weidu installations, though.

[Creepin]

Not for nothing I repeatedly advocated that BWS *not* encourage people to be dependent on it. It's a great tool but letting it become so central to mod installation was a mistake. Having it so closely tied to the BWFixPack was also a mistake. Keeping things distinct and modular ensures that people can keep going even if one link in the chain breaks.

Yes we became addicted, but for a very good reason: I remember with horror the pain of dragging through bloody 1000 pages of Big World manual, and the ability to relay this pain on the machine is a true blessing.

 

The existing (legacy) version of BWS is in good shape and pulls the most up-to-date versions of a lot of mods automatically... I could update my mods and BWS users will get the benefit of that, even if the BWS itself is not updated. So it's not useless just because AL|EN is leaving it;

It's in good shape so far: the more mods will squash its inter-incompatibilities, the more new mods introduce new ones, the more rules of installation are to be changed.

 

Agb1 and AL|EN and others did a lot of good work turning the BWFixPack into an independent, cross-platform entity. It's on Github for anyone to improve it, and it's in good shape right now

Sadly, BWFixpack already begun to deteriorate: right as we speak it asks me repeatedly if it should be applied to, as an example, v15 of the mod present (because someone somewhere for some unfathomable reason decided it's good idea to always pull latest version of the mod automatically) while BWFixpack only know how to handle v14. How the hell do I know!?

 

Wisp is working on a cross-platform GUI version of Weidu, which could perhaps take the place of the BWS. It doesn't auto-sort your install order, but install order is really not that difficult (QNISKTS - Quests, NPCs, Items, Spells, Kits, Tweaks, SCS).

Unless it autoarranges install order it's useless. Even if I dare to tread once again the swamp of "Step 324: install mod AAA. Step 325: install mod BBB. Step 326: zZZzzz...", how does this GUIdu plan to split installation of the same mod in 3 parts done at 3 different stages? BWS does this for a very good reason once again.

 

The mod scene will be fine. Mod users will have to buck up and deal with Weidu installations, though.

The scene might be fine, but the mod users will rather stuck with old versions of the mods than lose BWS, so this is where we and the scene will part ways.

[subtledoctor]

 

Wisp is working on a cross-platform GUI version of Weidu, which could perhaps take the place of the BWS. It doesn't auto-sort your install order, but install order is really not that difficult (QNISKTS - Quests, NPCs, Items, Spells, Kits, Tweaks, SCS).

Unless it autoarranges install order it's useless. Even if I dare to thread once again the swamp of "Step 324: install mod AAA. Step 325: install mod BBB. Step 326: zZZzzz...", how does this GUIdu plan to split installation of the same mod in 3 parts done at 3 different stages? BWS does this for a very good reason once again.

Oh come on dude don't sound so helpless. It will basically be like FOMM: drag mods into the proper order, then click "Go." There will be inumerable forums threads on install order, mod users can become intelligent, informed users again instead of mindless BWS drones. Maybe someone will make a LOOT-style utility for the ordering - the necessary information is right there in the BWS files, after all, anyone can access it. I've been planning to use it to create an ordering tool for my Mac Mod Installer (but that plan is back-burnered not that a GUI Weidu is on the way).

 

How many mods even need to be split up these days? Fewer and fewer.

 

People will most likely reduce the number of mods they use... like down to 100 from 300. But whatever, the games are still super fun with "only" 100 mods installed. And using 100 or so mods is actually not that bad with a bit of organization (which will be helped by the 1-click GUI Weidu).

 

Also... for heaven's sake, if you have a good source solid install, back it up and never let it go! This right here is evidence that people are too careless (probably as a result of becoming dependent on BWS). Some random mod gets updated, probably in a way you won't even notice, and people trash their stable installs and start from scratch... and then BWS craps out and they are high and dry. Losing BWS should not stop anyone from having a good megamod install, because people should never give up their last good stable megamod install! Keep that thing forever!

[Creepin]

Also... for heaven's sake, if you have a good source solid install, back it up and never let it go!

This I agree with: I have kept neat and sound BWS2016 install, top notch at that time, and even though I keep struggling with my BWS2017 for the last few days forcing it to use mods whose size it doesn't recognize and patch mods whose version is not the one intended to be patched, I'm starting to think if I should just revert to older install

[jastey]

And that is where modding is no longer fun: players who stick to older, bugged versions. I guess I can stop updating mods then.

 

Creepin: Small hint, if the mod is updated chances are high the fixes of the Fixpack are no longer needed. That's the case for all mods I recently updated, at least. If in doubt - ask the modder. We are talking about mods that got updated recently, after all, not mods whos author left the scene 5 years ago. Chances are high the modder is available for an answer.

[Roxanne]

Sticking to older versions that work is (in a limited way) an option for BGT.

 

For EET games the problem is more apparent. A number of mods only work under EET with fixpack patches (including SCS) while fixpack itself already starts to fail for mods updated within the last month. And since EET development is much more dynamic than old game, the gap gets wider.

 

One option (interim solution) could be to have a (github) repository for the EET-with-fixpack-patches mods, so players can download the EET-version of the mods in category three of the compliance list directly. I have a large number of such ready-patched mods at hand and maybe others have the rest?

Too bad that K4thos is missing as well, otherwise this could be done with links on the EET front page right away...

[lynx]

Can someone make a list of all the bw fixes that are now redundant?

 

I'll be bogged down for a few more days, but can then propose removals, write docs etc. Also, more reviewers will have to volunteer and the existing ones grant them access if they don't want to participate at all (otherwise a fork would be needed).

[Roxanne]

Can someone make a list of all the bw fixes that are now redundant?

 

I'll be bogged down for a few more days, but can then propose removals, write docs etc. Also, more reviewers will have to volunteer and the existing ones grant them access if they don't want to participate at all (otherwise a fork would be needed).

Here are some

http://www.shsforums.net/topic/56752-the-official-bwp-fixpack-thread/page-16?do=findComment&comment=594834

 

Also Romantic Encounters and BGQE and everything jastey has updated recently.

[jastey]

Is this the most recent version of the BWSFixpack?

 

If yes:

 

deprecated:

• Folder / use of _GavinHotfix should be removed (Gavin BG1 and BGII is updated with all changes from the Fixpack)
• Folder / use of "alternatives" as of v12
• Folder / use of "RE" as of v12

 

not deprecated:

• changes to Sir Ajantis BGII "ajantisbg2" (v14 has no EET comp yet). Fix can be used as-is.

[Creepin]

Small hint, if the mod is updated chances are high the fixes of the Fixpack are no longer needed. That's the case for all mods I recently updated, at least.

Chances is the keyword Should I refuse Fixpack hoping its fixes were incorporated taking a risk I voluntarily refused the fix for some bugs? Should I allow Fixpack presuming its fixes weren't incorporated hoping even if they actually were double appliance of such won't cause new unexpected bugs?

 

If in doubt - ask the modder. We are talking about mods that got updated recently, after all, not mods whos author left the scene 5 years ago. Chances are high the modder is available for an answer.

That is so brutally obvious I'm kind of ashamed for not thinking of it myself: thanks, will do so

 

Also Romantic Encounters and BGQE and everything jastey has updated recently.

I have both and Fixpack said nothing. Admittedly I use older version of RE so I'm not good example in this case but I'm sure I'm using latest BGQE.

 

Is this the most recent version of the BWSFixpack?

Yes, far as I can tell.

[Jarno Mikkola]

Should I allow Fixpack in case its fixes weren't incorporated hoping even if they actually were double appliance of such won't cause new unexpected bugs?

Yes, see the BWS Fixpacks fixes are targeted, they require a certain amount of code in the .tp2 file to apply the fix into it... so if the corrected .tp2 doesn't have the old code in it, the Fixpacks fix patch won't get applied, and it tells you that it didn't, in the install log and so the fix won't be needed anymore. This is the reason why there can be multiple fixes for the same mods different versions, to cover all of them..

 

Well, this is the principle that some of the fixes consist of... I can't actually say that they all do, as I haven't actually ever done any of them, but it's what I have read.