I might have found a way how to create a monk multi-class

[ProudCzech]

Hi guys, I need your help with something.

I'm quite new to modding, but I've slowly learned that "hardcoded" classes cannot be much edited or multi-classed, because our hands are tied by rules of Infinity Engine.

Even if we adjust the 2DA files, the main point of these classes can't be transferred to another class.

I said trasferred?

I tried to "transfer" monk abilities to my Fighter/Mage/Thief character and I succeed! At least it looked like it...

I created a spell which permanently polymorphed my character to Balthazar (BALTH.CRE). The appearance was changed and I got some of his stats and abilities. Especially "the monk fist" worked just like I was really a monk!

Naturally, there were bugs. Two-handed weapons had wrong animations, every other polymorph spell worked permanent, you couldn't cast any wizard or priest spell and so on. But I'd found at least a theoretical way how to remove these bugs, so I continued testing it.

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That time I thought that I obtained "the monk fist" because the Balthazar (BALTH.CRE) was a monk. So, I created another CRE file with monk class and appearance, but it had my own stats and colors. I set it as the model for the polymorph spell and it worked just fine.

But I didn't obtain "the monk fist"! Not only the animation, but also the damage and speed of this attack were gone!

You can try it yourself, but doesn't it mean that there is something else in BALTH.CRE file which allows you to obtain "the monk fist"? Like some imitable affects? Well, I didn't find these, but you can try it yourself...

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What I really want to ask is about "imitating" the monk class.

If you are a fighter, you should be adjustable to monk trough affects. I bet the real monk is hardcoded in that way. (The important affects are hidden just like the affects transfered to you through polymorph).

With that conviction I tried to create a set of SPL files that makes your fighter works like a monk and, of course, I got stuck at "the monk fist".

The animation is a one thing, but how can you limit the settings just for bare hands?

In Near Infinity, there is a type of effect called "Apply effect on equip type (183)" (B7 00). You can choose there the item type as "Hand-to-hand weapons (28)" (1c 00 00 00), so you should be theoretically able to limit some effects just to them.

But how can you do that? There is no box for choosing the effect! In the #183, you can set only the conditions, but no input, so there is no output!

Why is it even there?

Does someone know how to use it?

Thanks for answers.

[lynx]

I'm pretty sure there are several hardcoded monk checks all around (eg. AC, speed bonus), so this would be suboptimal even with working and correct fists.

 

Well, unless you use gemrb (any mc combo works) or the ees (externalised fist table from gemrb).

[subtledoctor]

The monk fists are just weapons like any other weapon... they simply happen to use a .BAM that makes them look like fists. If you make a fighter kit and give it the monk animation, you could try to grab my altered monk fists from here:

https://forums.beamdog.com/discussion/43878/might-and-guile-a-tweak-mod-and-kit-pack-for-warriors-and-rogues/p1

 

If you can get my monk fists onto your fighter kit, then it wouldn't be exactly like vanilla monks, but it should work fine for unarmed fighting. (Even, dare I say, better than vanilla!)

 

Just remember that the monk animation cannot use two-handed weapons, so make sure your fighter-monk only uses one-handed weapons.

[Jarno Mikkola]

I have made a fighter kit that's essentially a Monk/Sorcerer for BG2:ToB, so it's a non-EE kit... it works most of the time. You have to go around a lots of things, but this can be done if you really work at it. Ouh and as of that kit, the game sees the char as a Sorcerer. In BG2EE, you can make monk and Sorcerer kits.

It's the Gray Dragon here. I might have a more advanced version of it somewhere.

[lynx]

They are normal weapons in the originals too, the table is for automatic swapping on level-up and disabling the stunning-only casual fists (=default weapon).

[subtledoctor]

They are normal weapons in the originals too, the table is for automatic swapping on level-up and disabling the stunning-only casual fists (=default weapon).

 

Yeah, my mod just removes the vanilla fist weapons and replaces them with my own variants, with upgrades given via CLAB at certain levels, so they should be usable by any class or kit, not just monks. Functionally, what my mod does is allow the monk (or whoever has my new fist weapon) to switch at will between 'magic' fists that do blunt + magic damage, and 'normal' fists that do nonlethal damage.

[ProudCzech]

Hey, guys, thanks for answering.

 

At first, I would like to point out that I know that "the monk fists" are basicaly ITM weapon. The original ones are called MFIST1 to MFIST8. Their use is quite simple and they are all I need.

 

But to be accurate, I'm trying to copy the monk abilities with the greatest possible precision. And that means:

1) Some bonuses like speed can be used ONLY bare handed.

2) I can possibly use ALL MY WEAPONS SLOTS to weapons. If I simply put my own fist as a usual weapon, it takes one slot and that's pretty much, if you are multi-classed. :/

 

That's why I was primarily asking how to use the #183 effect. With it I can mod it myself.

 

 

I have made a fighter kit that's essentially a Monk/Sorcerer for BG2:ToB, so it's a non-EE kit... it works most of the time. You have to go around a lots of things, but this can be done if you really work at it. Ouh and as of that kit, the game sees the char as a Sorcerer. In BG2EE, you can make monk and Sorcerer kits.

It's the Gray Dragon here. I might have a more advanced version of it somewhere.

 

Yeah, I would like to play Monk/Sorcerer, too, but I must create the working monk first. I suppose that you added monk abilities to sorcerer and then matched the experience and others tables, didn't you?

 

A few days ago I would maybe use your version, but I'm gonna complete it myself when I got this far.

 

So I am asking for the third time: How does "Apply effect on equip type (183)" works?

[Jarno Mikkola]

You don't need to use the 183... but you can still check it out. It's use is very untested from what I can tell as not even the DLTCEP v7.7 has much on it, other than the remark UNTESTED.

What you want is to create(via a spell) the fist item and use that as the anchor in one of your weapon slots. While it's equipped, it can set thac0, attacks per round, damage etc and other facts when the user has it in use. The others can be left without the special fist and thus their use is dictated by the base class. The fist item can be upgraded during level ups, with opcodes 143.

You can even set it to change your avatar, but to change back, you would need something else.

 

In the Gray Dragon, I ended up using two special weapons with their own special progressions as the monk part, the Sorcerer class is just the usual sorcerer, and I set teh experience penalty so that it was "no where near to" close to 50/50 split.

Of course to make a Sorcerer kit in the non EE game, you have to use 2 kits, and a creature that makes the transition. But that's just what you have to do.

 

Ouh yea, I also made a few updates to the mod later in the posts... v(0.)91 was the latest I think.

[ProudCzech]

You don't need to use the 183... but you can still check it out. It's use is very untested from what I can tell as not even the DLTCEP v7.7 has much on it, other than the remark UNTESTED.

What you want is to create(via a spell) the fist item and use that as the anchor in one of your weapon slots. While it's equipped, it can set thac0, attacks per round, damage etc and other facts when the user has it in use. The others can be left without the special fist and thus their use is dictated by the base class. The fist item can be upgraded during level ups, with opcodes 143.

You can even set it to change your avatar, but to change back, you would need something else.

 

In the Gray Dragon, I ended up using two special weapons with their own special progressions as the monk part, the Sorcerer class is just the usual sorcerer, and I set teh experience penalty so that it was "no where near to" close to 50/50 split.

Of course to make a Sorcerer kit in the non EE game, you have to use 2 kits, and a creature that makes the transition. But that's just what you have to do.

 

Ouh yea, I also made a few updates to the mod later in the posts... v(0.)91 was the latest I think.

 

Well, I'm not surprised that #183 has in description "This effect has never been seen to work." I also noticed that it is fishy, but I thought it's stupidity on my side. Thanks for the straight answer.

 

If I understand it well, the effect shoud be the "Unused" box using 4 bytes input, but no one knows what it is, because EEF files are 8 bytes input. I don't think I'll find out anything, but I'm gonna play with it for a while.

 

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Your version of the monk seems to be an interesting reference. But didn't it bothered you, that you can't use the first weapon slot for another weapon when needed? Well, if I somehow could add myself one more slot, it would be a different story, but if I'm not mistaken, there is NOTHING you can do about that.

[ProudCzech]

Hey, I've found it!

 

I found the way how to use the #183!!!! I've seen this effect work!!!!

 

It's easy. At first, you prepare an EEF file of the desired effect and use #177 to set it in SPL file. Then you change the type of the effect from #177 to #183. This keeps there the name of EFF file in the HEX form in the below "Unused" box. All that remains is to set the conditions and it's done!

 

Yippee!!!!

 

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P: S. Shouldn't it be easier to use, if you could set it directly without #177? Is there a chance they add this option to the next version of Near Infinity?

[Jarno Mikkola]

Erhm, if you set the default setting of the 177 effect to the 183 effect aka ...

set param1 = 0, and param2 = 2

The recent Near Infinity says the effect affects the armor type item... which could be what you are seeing.
EDIT: OR it could be totally off, as not even Argent77 says it's for sure.

[ProudCzech]

Erhm, if you set the default setting of the 177 effect to the 183 effect aka ...

set param1 = 0, and param2 = 2

The recent Near Infinity says the effect affects the armor type item... which could be what you are seeing.

EDIT: OR it could be totally off, as not even Argent77 says it's for sure.

 

I programmed it this way during testing:

 

At fist I created an EFF file which can set the attacks per round to 5.

Then I have used #177 to easily find this EFF file in list. When I chose it, it converted the name to HEX, but #177 still showed it as a name.

Then I have pretended I changed my mind and FORCEFULLY CHANGED the #177 to #183.

The name of EFF file converted to hex remains there, but the name of box changed to "Unused".

Then I set the condition, that if the character equip any long sword type weapon, the EFF will activate.

And it's done.

 

 

When I tried it in the new game, I have 3/2 attacks per round, but when I equip a long sword, it changed to 5 attacks per round (unfortunately permanently).

 

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That's why I believe that the "Unused box" in the effect #183 should be changed to "Choose EFF file" in the next version of Near Infinity, because otherwise you have to put it there manualy in HEX or you have to use the trick with #177.

[ProudCzech]

Back to "the monk fist"...

 

I have already finished the mod and it works the way I want, but there is a one big problem:

 

The fists are created in "hand to hand" slot and this slot CANNOT be saved. (There is no "hand to hand" slot in saved game.)

 

So, whenever I load the game, my fists disappear. Of course I can use a castable spell to get it back, but is there a way how to automatically cast it when the game load?

 

Thanks for answers.

[Jarno Mikkola]

The fists are created in "hand to hand" slot and this slot CANNOT be saved. (There is no "hand to hand" slot in saved game.)

Erhm, are you sure ?

If it's just a normal item, and you use the opcode 143 with parameter 1 at 35, it's created in the first weapon slot the character has. He can use the other slots for other weapons, but this will be bound to that weapon.... especially if you make it unmovable with the item property flag.

 

When I tried it in the new game, I have 3/2 attacks per round, but when I equip a long sword, it changed to 5 attacks per round (unfortunately permanently).

Well, you do know you can set the effect to use while equipped too, not the permanent... so instead of timing mode 1, you use timing mode 2, in the effects offset 0x24.

[Fiann of the Silver Hand]

You don't need to "trick" NI to get the name of the EFF into any particular field. Right-click on an entry and you'll get the option to edit the field as binary, string, hex, etc. Just choose string.