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#1 CamDawg

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Posted 30 April 2018 - 07:49 AM

Today I'm taking a bit of an unusual step for G3 and announcing a moderation action. G3 prides itself, immensely, upon the fact that we've never banned anyone or deleted a post--save spambots, of course--and fortunately that will not be changing any time soon. That we continue to have open, honest, and meaningful interactions speaks not to the moderating staff, but to our users. What I'm doing today I do reluctantly, only because it undermines the trust that makes these open exchanges of information possible and because I see it as our best path forward.
 
A few weeks ago, a couple of users contacted me regarding some unusual activity on the forums. At my discretion I looked into it, found their concerns credible, and decided to investigate further. Given that this appeared to be an issue across several forums, I contacted JuliusBorisov at Beamdog and Creepin at SHS, gave them the information I had, and asked them to look into it, as I would at G3.

 

Our collaborative effort has revealed a rash of new posters within modding community--many guests, some registered--with similar posting styles and concerns. They were all big supporters and promoters of the Sandrah mod, EET and BWS. After looking into the accounts on our respective sites, we've confirmed they're alts of Roxanne.

 
Messages were sent to the suspected alternate accounts, seeing if they would respond. The goal, like any moderation action, was to try and inform the user that what they had done was wrong (and in the case of Beamdog, also against their forum rules), and get them to cease. We did receive a response, but not one we expected: no messages were returned, but a new batch of alts appeared from a slightly different source--and yes, they were also from Roxanne. This was disappointing, to say the least, and closed other avenues through which we could have addressed this. 
 
I will not speculate on the motivations behind making these alts, but I can say that they undermine open and honest communication, a cornerstone of G3's forums. With the opportunity to talk spurned we are left with few options. Both Julius (link to his post at Beamdog) and Creepin (link to his post at SHS) are posting today about the same issue, with additional details you may wish to peruse. While no alts have been found at G3 this investigation--and now, unfortunately, this public outing of its results--was instigated by me, and I will shoulder responsibility for it. Other than this post no other action is warranted at this time at G3; you can read more about decisions at Beamdog and SHS at the links above.


Edited by CamDawg, 30 April 2018 - 08:01 AM.
added links

I came here with a simple dream: a dream of killing all humans. And this is how it must end? Who's the real seven billion ton robot monster here? Not I. Not... I.


#2 Mirandel

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Posted 30 April 2018 - 11:47 AM

A very sad news :(



#3 Salk

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Posted 30 April 2018 - 10:52 PM

I think everyone here at G3 knows how heavily such decision weighs on you, considering that Roxanne has also been a very active user and modder both here and at SHS, helping out people too with suggestions and recommendations.

 

Thank you for dealing with the matter, even if it was something you wish you didn't have to do.



#4 jastey

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Posted 30 April 2018 - 11:45 PM

 Roxanne has also been a very active user and modder both here and at SHS, helping out people too with suggestions and recommendations.

Helping people or her own alts? It's a bitter, bitter pill to swallow.



#5 Salk

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Posted 30 April 2018 - 11:50 PM

 

 Roxanne has also been a very active user and modder both here and at SHS, helping out people too with suggestions and recommendations.

Helping people or her own alts? It's a bitter, bitter pill to swallow.

 

 

I know she helped me out a couple of times...

 

But yes, I do understand how you feel.



#6 Sidecar

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Posted 01 May 2018 - 02:43 AM

Hi, uh, I joined fairly recently just for asking questions and I'd like to clarify I'm not an alt. This is a really disappointing turn of events.

 

I just wanted to play mods? ???



#7 Hack'n'Slash

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Posted 01 May 2018 - 05:33 AM

Disappointing really.  There(possibly) goes help with BWS/EET installs. And the new patch coming soon.. This could be fun really.

 

On a lighter note, I wonder..... Was The Imp blocked by all of the incarnations?

 

(I changed my gravatar so I look like a real person - not an empty space)



#8 Jarno Mikkola

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Posted 01 May 2018 - 05:50 AM

On a lighter note, I wonder..... Was The Imp blocked by all of the incarnations?

Me, nope. :devil: :evilplan: :jump:

Should you undestand, I have JM here, while The Imp in SHS, cause I forgot the SHS password to the JM account there.


Welcome to the sanity, you are free to search for the limit, it's out there, we drew it in the sand.
Here's how to install all the ... mods you ever really could want to Infinity Engine games. I removed the stable word from there as Roxanne began to add BS mods that are likely to break compatibility from the BWS.

#9 CamDawg

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Posted 01 May 2018 - 08:41 AM

I think everyone here at G3 knows how heavily such decision weighs on you, considering that Roxanne has also been a very active user and modder both here and at SHS, helping out people too with suggestions and recommendations.

 

Thank you for dealing with the matter, even if it was something you wish you didn't have to do.

 

Thanks Salk. I was really hoping we could have resolved this with dialogue after the first wave of alts.

 

Hi, uh, I joined fairly recently just for asking questions and I'd like to clarify I'm not an alt. This is a really disappointing turn of events.

 

I just wanted to play mods? ???

 

If I thought you were an alt, I would have contacted you already. Don't worry. :)

 

However this is, unfortunately, going to be the real legacy of all this. BWS, EET, and Sandrah have fans, and they're now going to be greeted with suspicion--justifiably, sadly--wherever they go. I ask that everyone please keep an open mind and welcome everyone to the forums, just as you did before. If you do suspect a alt, drop a PM to me or one of the other admins. Please so not poison the well of public discussion with unfounded accusations.

 

Disappointing really.  There(possibly) goes help with BWS/EET installs. And the new patch coming soon.. This could be fun really.

 

Yeah, this is something that came up repeatedly in the discussions leading up to this. Roxanne really has done a phenomenal job with BWS and EET maintenance, both of which are absolutely thankless jobs. My sincere hope remains that she stays and remains active in the community--without the alts, of course.


I came here with a simple dream: a dream of killing all humans. And this is how it must end? Who's the real seven billion ton robot monster here? Not I. Not... I.


#10 AstroBryGuy

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Posted 01 May 2018 - 09:29 AM

Reading the threads Creepin linked at SHS are kind of surreal, once you realize many of the participants are one person (most in some stretches).



#11 bob_veng

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Posted 01 May 2018 - 11:23 AM

It's best to just move on in a constructive and respectful manner without déplacé bewilderment (this phenomenon is as old as the internet). We all have a sensibility for roleplaying after all.

#12 AWizardDidIt

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Posted 01 May 2018 - 01:42 PM

Edit: after further thought, I think I'll just keep my comments to myself. Best to just acknowledge this and move on.


Edited by AWizardDidIt, 02 May 2018 - 07:11 AM.


#13 Sidecar

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Posted 02 May 2018 - 01:02 AM

Well now that my innocence is cleared, I want to say that I harbor no ill will against her and I think many here are willing to forgive.

 

She seemed to be a valued member of this community and I for one hope she can return with newfound honesty.



#14 Caserius Tendook

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Posted 09 May 2018 - 08:26 PM

I used to play some limited classic game stuff over the years and always enjoyed G3's forums and community.  When the EE's came out I discovered Beamdog and SHS and learned some things about how modding all works.  About a year ago I found the Mega Mods and fell in love with the game, the content and mods all over again.

 

The last several months I have gotten a great Mod education from a significant number of people at all three of these forums.  I have truly enjoyed what I have learned here thru multiple people, and Roxanne has been a big helpful part of that.  Subtle Doc has also been a big help and quite funny to follow.  I really thought a long time ago that G3 would eventually fade away as the game faded, but it has survived and appears to prosper, I sincerely hope that continues and that the Modders (all of them) continue to support the update of their Mods and especially the Tools like BWS and BWS-EE tool, that turn the product that was created, turned into the massive universe it has become.  The modding of this game is the equivalent of the hundreds, and thousands of hours I spent playing AD&D thru the years.

 

Thanks to everyone involved.  I hope Roxanne stays involved in the community in a manner that she has in helping people out.  I realize some folks are upset at the multiple accounts, self promotion, and singular conversations that were happening, but for me unless you have someone going out of their way to demean, belittle, and/or denigrate others we just might want to not cast to many stones at our own glass houses.  I'm not saying it's acceptable to behave in this manner, to the contrary, I think it's important that the Admins of all three sites have shed some daylight on the whole matter, but I would hope as a community designed to be a place for resource and information repository, can see past personal foibles, and focus on setting the ship straight.



#15 jastey

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Posted 09 May 2018 - 10:35 PM

It's funny how there's always voices who try to sooze "the community" not to be too harsh towards Roxanne.

I can only stress, and repeat: Roxanne - as in, the user account "Roxanne" - is still welcome in this community, and I don't even expect the person behind it to always be friendly and helpful. Just show your face in a way it's clear who's talking, like not deceaving to be someone else, dammit.
 

but for me unless you have someone going out of their way to demean, belittle, and/or denigrate others

Yeah, well, but that did happen, too. So, instead of insinuating that - somehow, in some way - all of us are like this, walking around in our own glass houses, and to call upon the community to bend the rules and "hey, don't be so resentful, aren't we all little deceivers?" - I at least, did not create alt accounts and did not do this kind of stuff - how about, you know, call upon Roxanne not to do this any more? Just as a thought. I, at least, would like to read this from players who profited from Roxanne's help and think in her favor because of it for a change.*

But, somehow, all I read is "but she was so helpful so please, jump over your own shadow because it surely wasn't that bad?".

Yes, it was that bad. I regret any single minute I obviously spent explaining mod related things to Roxanne_alt_no_x, Roxanne_alt_no_y, ... Roxanne_alt_no_z. I regret every minute I read "PaulaMigrate" praising the deeper wisdoms inside the Sandrah Saga, believing that the world is big and that there is fans for everything. I regret feeling I have had to step in and explain to new players at several occasions that no, EET does not automatically include the Sandrah Saga's content as Roxanne proclaimed with several alt accounts pretending it was some kind of common knowledge only some of us can't see yet. I can retrace the deceiving game now and I am not amused.

What a waste of time. (You know, time I could have spent with actually doing modding stuff. The time it took me to phrase this post included. I could have updated three mods for BWS instead, for example. Instead, I used my free time of the morning to whine the frustration off my soul.)



* (if you are one - what do I know who's behind a user account, especially one that is in constant exchange with Roxanne, as this thread shows it could be literally anybody. But no, you don't need to stress that you are not the same person - duh, it's all mute anyway.)





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