Monks

[Demivrgvs]

If you wish so I can easily put more ideas on the table, mostly taken from Pathfinder's Quinggong archetype.

If you want to test it sooner rather than later, I think we should include as many of the possible abilities as is feasible.

You may be right...

 

Would the class appeal improve by adding Ki Arrow (a powerful ranged ki blast) and Ki Shout (AoE blast of ki energy which can potentially stun victims - already planned as Kensai HLA)?

Yes, I think these would be nice additions. They seem fine to me when thinking about the Dragonball Z monk archetype (LOL). It seems like Ki could be channeled as a projectile of force if not energy. I wonder if the others think this is too arcane-seeming?

I don't know which damage type fits best to simulate a force effect, even arcane/divine spells with force effects sometimes use/cause a physical damage (crushing) and other times pure magic damage.

 

Regarding monks becoming a little bit mystical I see nothing wrong about it, not to mention the new BGEE kits are pretty much forced to do so. Within PnP the Dark Moon Monk actually is a sort of multiclass monk/sorcerer.

 

Well, as long as it's not a permanent feature, but a once/day ability, we might even try it (though it would fit best an HLA imo), but I'm 99% sure it's best to avoid it, simply because the AI (not even SCS AI) is prepared to counter a PC character immune to TS. Otho...

Does SCS AI rely so heavily upon Timestop that immunity to it would be game-breaking? *Edit: If so, it sounds like it may need to be nerfed!

Nerf what? o.O Anyway, I'm almost sure DavidW once warned me to never use Time Stop immunity because his AI would not be able to properly react to it.

 

Do you want me to make a really really crazy suggestion? Taking again inspiration from Pathfinder's Monk of the Four Winds...what about a "Slow Time" ability, aka a 1 round Time Stop? Would it be completely broken? I think not if it's just 1 round... Ok, I'm officialy more crazy than Jarno now.

Slow Time could start as a Slow effect on foes in a radius around the monk (not a perfect solution because projectiles would not be slowed, ruining the illusion). It could then improve to stopped time later or with an HLA. Either way, I am fine with this. It is a pity that you can't make abilities use up more than one Ki point.

Considering that Slow Time uses SIX ki points in PnP, it would be kinda mandatory to make it a separate ability. Nothing prevents us from giving a second use via HLA. Wait a second...why am I talking like we already agreed on using this idea?

[kreso]

I'm for a big big NO to TS immunity. Exploits it opens up are beyond stupid (casting TS with your mage then using Monk to beat enemies up.), it will cause AI issues, and very few creatures have this immuntiy - Mellisan and Demogorgon (which, if you want to Role-play Monk, you shouldn't even be fighting imo). Since Ascension is pretty-much a standard install option, you'll get this ability when you should - in final battle. Any other point in game is wrong.

Otoh, I also agree monks could be bit more "mystic". Just don't give TS immunity and I'll agree with everything.

On a side-note, if you could just remove their stupid movement speed boost and do nothing else, I'd be more than happy to try them out. In BG1 he charges in front of everyone without headgear or armor.....

[Grammarsalad]

I like Ki arrow and Ki shout.

 

I don't like the pnp version so the farther you go from that the better, imo.

 

Basically this:

"If you want to test it sooner rather than later, I think we should include as many of the possible abilities as is feasible."

 

A agree, though, that they shouldn't get timestop immunity.

[Kalindor]

Then a Timestop of their on due to a short burst of incredible speed does sound like it would be appealing for the Monk. Limited uses of that would help alleviate the concern about them abusing friendly mages' Timestop spells.

[Demivrgvs]

I'm for a big big NO to TS immunity. Exploits it opens up are beyond stupid (casting TS with your mage then using Monk to beat enemies up.), it will cause AI issues, and very few creatures have this immuntiy - Mellisan and Demogorgon (which, if you want to Role-play Monk, you shouldn't even be fighting imo). Since Ascension is pretty-much a standard install option, you'll get this ability when you should - in final battle. Any other point in game is wrong.

I completely agree.

 

On a side-note, if you could just remove their stupid movement speed boost and do nothing else, I'd be more than happy to try them out. In BG1 he charges in front of everyone without headgear or armor.....

You may have noticed that I haven't spoken of faster base movement rate anywhere. The way I see it, the few times you really need to move fast you can use Ki Step to move extremely fast (and later on Abundant Step to instantly move where you wish), the other times the base speed is more than enough. Not to mention that if you play with a IR you might already move faster than any armored warrior (it's an optional component, so anyone can do what he prefers on this matter).

 

Anyway...the current template looks like this:

 

01: Unarmed Strike (1d6), Mindful Defense (AC7 ?), Flurry of Blows (+1 apr), Ki Pool 1/day (Stunning Fist, Ki Dodge, Ki Step)

02:

03: Unarmed Strike (1d8), +1/2 apr, Ki Pool 2/day, Deflect Arrows

04: Ki Arrow (added to ki pool)

05: Purity of Body (immunity to disease)

06: Unarmed Strike (1d8 +1), +1/2 apr, Ki Pool 3/day

07: Wholeness of Body (added to ki pool)

08: Clear Mind (immunity to charm)

09: Unarmed Strike (1d10 +1), +1/2 apr, Ki Pool 4/day

10: Abundant Step (upgrade to Ki Step)

11: Diamond Body (immunity to poison)

12: Unarmed Strike (1d10 +2), +1/2 apr, Ki Pool 5/day

13: Quivering Palm 1/day

14: Diamond Soul (+2 to saves)

15: Unarmed Strike (1d12 +2), +1/2 apr, Ki Pool 6/day

16: Ki Shout 1/day?

17: Slow Time 1/day?

18: Unarmed Strike (1d12 +3), +1/2 apr, Ki Pool 7/day

19: Empty Body (upgrade to Ki Dodge)

20: Perfect Self (+1 STR, DEX & WIS)

 

It's far from definitive (e.g. I'm not sure about levels 16 and 17), but for a first test it should be fine imo. I'm still pondering how to implement the grappling maneuver (I'd add it at level 2) and the possibility of adding a couple of "styles" (aka stances). We'll see...

[kreso]

I'm for a big big NO to TS immunity. Exploits it opens up are beyond stupid (casting TS with your mage then using Monk to beat enemies up.), it will cause AI issues, and very few creatures have this immuntiy - Mellisan and Demogorgon (which, if you want to Role-play Monk, you shouldn't even be fighting imo). Since Ascension is pretty-much a standard install option, you'll get this ability when you should - in final battle. Any other point in game is wrong.

I completely agree.

On a side-note, if you could just remove their stupid movement speed boost and do nothing else, I'd be more than happy to try them out. In BG1 he charges in front of everyone without headgear or armor.....

You may have noticed that I haven't spoken of faster base movement rate anywhere. The way I see it, the few times you really need to move fast you can use Ki Step to move extremely fast (and later on Abundant Step to instantly move where you wish), the other times the base speed is more than enough. Not to mention that if you play with a IR you might already move faster than any armored warrior (it's an optional component, so anyone can do what he prefers on this matter).

Exellent then...load them up, I'd be happy to try them.

[Grammarsalad]

For a "force" damage type, I'd go with crushing. It's supposed to be something like "kinetic"energy right? Or you could just use magic. You might even do half each